SGP
Halo Reach => BOBs => Topic started by: ColdGlider on October 26, 2011, 20:45:51
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I wanted to share an idea about the Beach BOB. There are multiple check points at the beginning of LNoS, with more than a few scripts that get executed before you even enter the building. I'm wondering if the insta-despawn behavior is occurring because the BOB script checks for an objective state that is not being met.
Lord Friendship has deduced that the insta-despawn behavior occurs when the BOB tries to spawn at the same time as the pier dropship is leaving. And he's done so much work on that, I'm sure this is a correct observation. But would it still happen if you never entered the launch facility, thereby triggering the first objective?
In that mission, you don't get an actual objective set up in your start menu until you walk into the base. You can walk up to the DMRs, go visit and kill the wraith on the pier, and basically anything else you want to do without triggering an objective- provided you keep out of the base. You do get a waypoint marker set, but if you check the start menu you'll see that there is no current objective.
So perhaps running into the building to get the rockets (thereby triggering the objective to get to the Sabers) is messing everything up. The BOB might be spawning "out of order" of its intended sequence, the logic checks and sees that it should not have spawned, so it cleans itself up the second it spawns.
I've had no luck getting the Beach BOB to spawn recently, but I'll keep trying.
LF, your input here will be invaluable if you can stomach talking about this darned BOB any more!
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Haven't seen any map concerning BOB's or maps in general. I would suggest trying to get out of map and taking some Ariel shots so that the area can be mapped properly. Doing this might also allow you to locate the drop pod for the bob way before it even crashes down, this may also show you what triggers it...
OR I WILL CONTINUE TO DO THIS!!! (attached)
Side note: My online is currently disabled...Seems to be the work of the Covenant..I mean Comcast.
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Haven't seen any map concerning BOB's or maps in general. I would suggest trying to get out of map and taking some Ariel shots so that the area can be mapped properly. Doing this might also allow you to locate the drop pod for the bob way before it even crashes down, this may also show you what triggers it...
OR I WILL CONTINUE TO DO THIS!!! (attached)
Side note: My online is currently disabled...Seems to be the work of the Covenant..I mean Comcast.
Maps are pretty useless in linear levels. If we show you a picture of the place and you miss it, you probably won't find the BOB anyway. We should have a map for New Alexandria, though.
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Haven't seen any map concerning BOB's or maps in general. I would suggest trying to get out of map and taking some Ariel shots so that the area can be mapped properly. Doing this might also allow you to locate the drop pod for the bob way before it even crashes down, this may also show you what triggers it...
OR I WILL CONTINUE TO DO THIS!!! (attached)
Side note: My online is currently disabled...Seems to be the work of the Covenant..I mean Comcast.
Maps are pretty useless in linear levels. If we show you a picture of the place and you miss it, you probably won't find the BOB anyway. We should have a map for New Alexandria, though.
MAPS USELESS?
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Haven't seen any map concerning BOB's or maps in general. I would suggest trying to get out of map and taking some Ariel shots so that the area can be mapped properly. Doing this might also allow you to locate the drop pod for the bob way before it even crashes down, this may also show you what triggers it...
OR I WILL CONTINUE TO DO THIS!!! (attached)
Side note: My online is currently disabled...Seems to be the work of the Covenant..I mean Comcast.
Maps are pretty useless in linear levels. If we show you a picture of the place and you miss it, you probably won't find the BOB anyway. We should have a map for New Alexandria, though.
MAPS USELESS?
When there's a set path, and you can't go anywhere but that path, yes, maps are useless.
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Side note: My online is currently disabled...Seems to be the work of the Covenant..I mean Comcast.
Maps are pretty useless in linear levels. If we show you a picture of the place and you miss it, you probably won't find the BOB anyway. We should have a map for New Alexandria, though.
MAPS USELESS?
When there's a set path, and you can't go anywhere but that path, yes, maps are useless.
There isn't always a set path though, on any level. I too am cursed by comcast.
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Haven't seen any map concerning BOB's or maps in general. I would suggest trying to get out of map and taking some Ariel shots so that the area can be mapped properly. Doing this might also allow you to locate the drop pod for the bob way before it even crashes down, this may also show you what triggers it...
OR I WILL CONTINUE TO DO THIS!!! (attached)
Side note: My online is currently disabled...Seems to be the work of the Covenant..I mean Comcast.
Maps are pretty useless in linear levels. If we show you a picture of the place and you miss it, you probably won't find the BOB anyway. We should have a map for New Alexandria, though.
MAPS USELESS?
When there's a set path, and you can't go anywhere but that path, yes, maps are useless.
Its more for the sake of mapping location (BOB drop/ enemy spawns/ weapon location/ triggers/ vehicles) It could even be broken down into sectors or a grid for easy reference. Just because we all know the level doesn't mean we know where/what/who or when something changes/happens. having a map would for sure make the BOB guild that much better. Not everyone can watch the videos but everyone can see a picture...as long as they are not blind....or dead......
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Haven't seen any map concerning BOB's or maps in general. I would suggest trying to get out of map and taking some Ariel shots so that the area can be mapped properly. Doing this might also allow you to locate the drop pod for the bob way before it even crashes down, this may also show you what triggers it...
OR I WILL CONTINUE TO DO THIS!!! (attached)
Side note: My online is currently disabled...Seems to be the work of the Covenant..I mean Comcast.
Maps are pretty useless in linear levels. If we show you a picture of the place and you miss it, you probably won't find the BOB anyway. We should have a map for New Alexandria, though.
MAPS USELESS?
When there's a set path, and you can't go anywhere but that path, yes, maps are useless.
Its more for the sake of mapping location (BOB drop/ enemy spawns/ weapon location/ triggers/ vehicles) It could even be broken down into sectors or a grid for easy reference. Just because we all know the level doesn't mean we know where/what/who or when something changes/happens. having a map would for sure make the BOB guild that much better. Not everyone can watch the videos but everyone can see a picture...as long as they are not blind....or dead......
Honestly, what's easier for you? A vague map, or an in game picture of the Spire?
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I'll provide any info you guys need, but honestly I'm not sure what the problem here is. I don't know why the Beach BOB despawns, but I'm about 75% sure it's tied to the dropship order. I don't think you can get him to show up before the dropships arrive.
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So, WHEN does the drop pod drop?
While I've played the Beach part (just for fun :P), I don't recall ever having seen a BOB, actually. All that I've noticed is that the next wave wont arrive until you've killed all of the enemies of the earlier wave.
So, I just thought: could we use this fact for our gain?
The BOB doesn't ALWAYS despawn, does it? That should mean that it's respawn time is not affected by the same variables that affect the Spirit (assuming that it's the Spirit that causes the despawn). Could it be possible to simply wait for the BOB to drop, and not killing any of the Covenant in the meantime, preventing the next wave to land?
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I talked a little about it here with an attached map I made but at the time was not sure what triggered the event.
Maybe the Wraith has something to do with it? Remember that Halo 3 skull where if you took out the AA wraiths the skull (don't remember which one) would despawn? So the only way to get the skull located on top of some kind of tanks was to make sure the AA's were NOT destroyed. So either the BOB script is totally F'ed up OR something must not be destroyed.
Attached is the kind of map I am talking about...
http://www.gruntspajamas.com/forum/index.php?topic=1582.0 (http://www.gruntspajamas.com/forum/index.php?topic=1582.0)
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So, WHEN does the drop pod drop?
DISCLAIMER: THIS MATERIAL SUBJECT TO CHANGE
I'm attempting to document the Level Flow. Things may not be perfect. Work-in-progress.
CG >> 2011.10.27 11:51 >> Edited content of Starting, Drop Pod, and Front Yard areas based on gameplay session.
1: Starting Area
No immediate enemies. Lots of "oooh aaah" music.
Note that the first two drop pods have not fallen yet in the Drop Pod area. An invisible "soft barrier" will prevent you from moving too far into the "Drop Pod Area" in Theater Mode. The barrier actually lines up with the second drop pod when it falls.
You can stay in this area as long as you want to listen to the "oooh aaah" music, provided that:
1) You don't hit the first trigger.
2) You don't go out of bounds and get the "Return to the Battlefield" message. This will stop the music completely when you return.
Initial Script:
- Spartan AIs run up the first hill to engage the enemy, but stop and wait for you.
- A Spirit drops off the initial enemies in the "Drop Pod Area" ahead while you are here.
Triggers:
1. An invisible trigger on the way up the hill will fire off the "Attack" script.
2. An invisible trigger further up the hill will cause a "Loading..." message. [need to confirm what gets loaded]
3. An invisible trigger past the apex of the hill will remove the "soft barrier" at the second drop pod's location.
Attack Script:
- All three Spartan AI players will advance into the "Drop Pod" area and engage the enemies there.
- The music will change.
- The first drop pod will fall on the left (toward the water)
- The second drop pod will fall to the right.
2: Drop Pod Area
This is the first location of battle and the site of four scripted drop pod landings.
Drop Pod 1
D@E: Contains Elite Minor (Blue)
Drop Pod 2
D@E: Contains Elite Officer (Red)
Drop Pod 3
D@E: Contains Elite Minor (Blue)
Drop Pod 4
D@E: Contains Elite Ultra (White)
Triggers:
1a. An invisible trigger along the way to the second hill will cause Drop Pod 3 to fall.
1b. A kill trigger will cause Drop Pod 3 to fall.
2a. An invisible trigger along the way to the second hill will cause Drop Pod 4 to fall.
2b. A kill trigger will cause Drop Pod 4 to fall.
3. An invisible trigger near the top of the second hill will fire off the "Crash Script"
4. Unknown trigger causes Spirit to drop Wraith in "Wraith Pier" area.
5. Killing all enemies in area will cause the AI Spartains to proceed to the Front Yard area.
"Crash Script":
- A spirit will drop in the initial enemies of the "Front Yard" area
- The drop pod collision with the launch facility will occur, creating the hole in the side of the building.
It's possible to bypass Trigger 4 and prevent the Wraith from dropping ahead in the Wraith Pier area.
I've noticed that Drop Pod 1 will despawn later in the mission (garbage collection), but others will remain.
The second hill marks the end of this area.
3: Front Yard Area
As the name suggests, this is the area immediately in front of the launch facility, one of two areas where (eventually) infinite waves of enemies will be dropped by incoming Spirit dropships. This is also the area containing two of the three alternate spawn points for BOB 6-S-01 (the third is on the Wraith Pier.)
Triggers:
1. Invisible trigger on approach to launch facility will fire "Drop Pod 5" Script
2. Killing the initial enemies will fire the "Incoming Spartan" script.
"Drop Pod 5" Script:
- Drop Pod 5 will land to the right of the entrance to the launch facility, right on top of the impact marks (which actually exist before the drop pod lands there!)
"Incoming Spartan" Script:
- Male voice yells "Everyone inside, more hostiles on the way!"
- Female voice yells "Spartans coming in! Watch your fire!"
- The AI Spartans will enter the Launch Facility
- A Pelican will drop off a squad of UNSC Marines to fend off the infinite waves. (At least one marine tends to have rockets)
- The infinite waves begin. A Spirit Dropship will spawn in, drop a wave of enemies near the water, and split. When the enemies are dead, the process repeats.
4: Wraith Pier
Between the entrance of the launch facility and the water (veer left of the entrance) is the Wraith Pier, where a wraith will be dropped. According to Lord Friendship's analysis, this wraith must be destroyed in order to cause the Beach BOB to spawn if he has been selected to spawn anywhere in this area.
This area contains the third alternative spawn point for BOB 6-S-01.
Infinite Waves of enemies will be dropped on the pier under certain conditions (probably the destruction of the Wraith coupled with the clearing of the initial enemies from the Front Yard.
I can't recall exactly when and why the Wraith is dropped off at the pier. I have a feeling that it happens outside of the "Incoming Spartan" Script. I think you can have the infinite waves of Spirits happening in the Front Yard, while the Wraith just sits on the pier and no Spirits drop in there. If this is true, it makes sense that you have to destroy the Wraith to make way for the Spirit to drop the BOB- IF he was selected to spawn at the Pier. If he is selected to spawn at one of the two location in the Front Yard, can the Wraith still be there?
As I analyze this level from a scripting perspective, I'm starting to see more clearly where LF is coming from. I'm also starting to think that the insta-despawn behavior could possibly be explained by an expired timer condition. Perhaps the BOB expiration timer is set to high value to account for three incoming Spirit waves and begins counting down with the Incoming Spartans script. If you "block" the Spirits by not clearing the Front Yard enemies or the wraith, when the BOB eventually appears, the expiration timer is long past expired. The script spawns the BOB, and it immediately checks its timer and despawns.
So in closing, I think that if we nail down where the BOB timer begins, we can make sure to clear the area in enough time for him to stick around. Regardless of incoming/outgoing Spirit status.
Got your rebuttal cannon primed? Fire away!
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Nice one!
LF, anyone: Do you have video clips of this BOB that could be used for this study? As I said, I've never even seen this BOB myself, and even though I will do studying in the level itself, I think that we should also study the material we already have, before we go and record the same material again. :D
This is truly an interesting one! :)
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It may also be worth noting that marines do not classify the BOB as an enemy, they will not shoot it or even acknowledge its existence. Even if they are being shot by it.
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LF, anyone: Do you have video clips of this BOB that could be used for this study? As I said, I've never even seen this BOB myself, and even though I will do studying in the level itself, I think that we should also study the material we already have, before we go and record the same material again. :D
I've got footage here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFTZ6Ti5ECc) that's just from a rendered video. If you go here (http://forums.bungie.org/halo/archive36.pl?read=1078377) the second video shows a perspective where you can see the tuning forks coming and going.
As for any BOB (except Lone Wolf), I've got a video saved from me taking him down on Legendary. I've only done the one Beach BOB, but when I return to that level for the no-death runs I'll get all three. In any case, if anyone needs the full video I can put it in my File Share. Just let me know.
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Check my file share. There is a film clip of the BOB (my film clip filenames are prefaced by "FC_") and there is also the full saved film, which will simply be called "Long Night of Solace". They will probably be dated 10/28. I did not complete the mission- I ended the film shortly after the BOB despawned.
I got the BOB to spawn in the Front Yard, and he stuck around without me killing him. I did blow up the wraith.
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@Lord Friendship: I've been meaning to report that I got the Beach BOB to spawn without destroying or moving the wraith. This may or may not be interesting to you. A film clip should be in my share. Before I get all crazy about it, is this even news to you? I believe your original article mentioned that you had to kill or move the wraith in order for the BOB to spawn.
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@Lord Friendship: I've been meaning to report that I got the Beach BOB to spawn without destroying or moving the wraith. This may or may not be interesting to you. A film clip should be in my share. Before I get all crazy about it, is this even news to you? I believe your original article mentioned that you had to kill or move the wraith in order for the BOB to spawn.
Yeah, I'd like to see that. From what I remember, the BOB has to drop in while one dropship is leaving, but the other is not arriving? It's been a while, but I do seem to recall that I couldn't get him to spawn without taking out the Wraith. Other videos I saw included one person who had jacked the Wraith and moved it away from the pier, just enough to get the pier Dropship to arrive at just the right time, hence getting the BOB to stick around briefly. Let me know if you put a clip of that on YouTube, or at least a link to the video in your File Share.